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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMinutes 1999DRAFT NOT APPROVED MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, September 14, 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 MEMBERS PRESENT: M. Larsen, J. Weiss, J. Macsai, L Berkun MEMBERS ABSENT: C. Thomas STAFF PRESENT: B. Fahistrom OTHERS PRESENT: Mr. Rodney Manna N.S.I. Signs John Doyle Doyle Signs OTHER BUSINES: None CITIZEN COMMENT None MINUTES Chairman Larsen declared a quorum at 7:35 p.m. Larsen motioned to approve the ffmWing minutes of August 10, 2000. The meeting minutes were approved unanimously. S.R.A.B. A00-25: 2002 Mapel Street — "Atfstate Insurance". Mr. Rod Menna of N.S.I. Signs presented his case. His client (Roger O'Donnell who is an Allstate Insurance Agent) is requesting an illuminated window sign with additional vinyl letter graphics for the front east facing window. Mr. O'Donnell's landlord will not allow him to have any signage on the front face of the building. The landlord is requesting all black copy for this sign_ Currently. Mr. O'Donnell has a small temporary sign in the front window. Because the landlord will not allow Mr. O'Donnell to have any signage on the front of the building , Mr. O'Donnel would like to have a small sign at the rear of the building where people park The proposed sign would match the size of the existing parking sign. This sign would contain the name "Allstate Insurance' and the agent's business telephone number. J. Macsai noted that such a sign is not a directional or a parking sign but is in essence, pure advertising Mr. O'Donnell is also requesting additional window sign in the north facing double hung side windows. Mr. O'Donnell is hoping that these signs would be seen by passers by and people in the neighborhood. Chairman Larsen and J. Macsai pointed out that the proposed north facing window signs are very difficult to see from the street and would do very little to help Mr. O'Donnell's business. J.Weiss asked staff how many business establishments were located in this building. B. Fahlstrom stated it appeared that there were at least 4 businesses. J. Weiss stated that this building may require a Unified Sign Plan and that the owner has a responsibility to straighten out the signage on this building. L. Berkun and J. Macsai agree with J. Weiss. J. Macsai noted that wall signs would be preferable to window signs that were in this case, aesthetically very chaotic. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes -September 14, 2000 Page 2 of 3 J. Macsai stated that until the landlord brought the whole buddkV into compliance under a Unidsd Sign Plan that perhaps the Board should allow Mr. O'Donnell to have the proposed east facing window sign. B. Fahlstrom stated that the Board could vote to table the request and proceed to notify the landlord that his building would require a Unified Sign Plan. A grief discussion followed concerning the change to a black color for the Allstate sign. L. Berkun noted that the proposed rear advertising sign was not visible from the street and could only be seen by a person who was on foot or a bicycle. A diswssion followed on the proposed rear sign as a parking sign J. Weiss motioned to table this variation request so that City Staff could verify that this building required a United Sign plan and so notify the landlord that he must have a Unified Sign plan prepared for this building at 2002 Maple. J. Weiss noted that if I* landlord did a really good job with a Unified Sign plan for 2002 Maple that Mr. O'Donnell would get far better sign exposure than he currently has. J. Macsai seconded the motion and stated that he wanted the record to show although this request was tabled. that the Board did not approve of the north facing window signs or the proposed rear parking area sign. A vote was taken on the following motion: The request for a sign variation for the Allstate office at 2002 Maple shall be tabled for the present subject to the following. 1. City staff will investigate if the 2002 Maple Building contains 4 or more business establishments and the landlord must provide a Unifsed Business Center Sign Plan for this building. 2. The request for the rear wall mounted Allstate Sign and the north facing window sign in the existing double hung windows is denied. The vote was taken and this motion passed unanimousty. S.R.A.B. #00-26: 635-10 Chicago Avenue: "For Eves". Mr. John Doyle of Doyle Signs presented his case. Mr. Doyle presented an amended variation request that showed a different design for the channel letters than was shown in the packets his firm had submitted to City staff for presentation at this Sign Board. The new design showed 2'— 0' high individual channel letters in a 'Futuna' type face. The wand 'FOR' was in black trim caps and satin black returns. The word 'EYES' was in white trim caps and satin white returns. Mr. Doyle took a few minutes to explain the new sign design to the Board. He explained that the area of the sign was 28.8 square feet (2.0 Feet x 12.66 Feet). The black on while look is the new corporate image for the company. M. Larsen reviewed the unified sign plan requirements with the board. Mr. Doyle pointed out that the For Eyes storefront is a double storefront and this single sign would serve for both stores. Mr Doyle then alleged that some of the existing signs such as 'Sallie's Beauty Supplies' or 'H.R. Block" have colors that do not quite conform to the Rome and Haas colors specified under the existing unified sign plan. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes -September 14, 2000 Page 3. M. Larsen stated that he would be wiping to approve the color change but the sign height shoWd be limited to 18". Mr. Doyle stated that it would be difficult for him to justify an 18` high sign to his client when other stones were already at 2' — 0' of height A general discussion followed on the history of the sign plan for the South Pointe Center. J. Weiss asked staff to investigate the current state of signs at the the South Pointe Plaza to determine if certain signs are out of compliance with the Existing Unified Sign Plan. S. Fahlstrom stated that the City would investigate the history of Sign permits for the Center. J. Macsai asked if this variance could be tabled. A general discussion followed on the rrom is of having a new revised unified sign plan prepared for the South Pointe Center. A second general discussion followed concerning re -writing the Sign Ordinance to allow more variation in the Unified Center Sign Plans. L. Berkun motioned to table this variation request subject to having City Staff research the current state of conformance with the Unified Sign Plan and look into the history of permit approvals for the South Pointe Center. Larsen seconded and the motion was passed unanimously. Mr. Doyle offered to consult with the Board on the re- writing of the Sign Ordinance ADJOURNMENT Hearing no other business, Chairman Larsen motioned adjournment at 8:35. NEXT MEETING The next meeting of the S.R.A.B. Is scheduled for Thursday October 12, 2000. BA Fahlstrom, Plan E *aminer Community Development — Building Division Cc: J. Wolinski C. Smith K. Mims AGENDA SIGN REVIEW & APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, September 14, 2000 Evanston Civic Center — Room 2404, 7:30 P.M. 1. MINUTES Consideration to Approve of the meeting minutes of August 10, 2000. 11. CITIZEN COMMENT Ill. NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. #00-25: 2202 Maple - Allstate Insurance Proposal to add rear wall sign on alley and north facing Window signs to existing building. S.R.A.B. #00-26: 63S-10 Chicago — For Eves ODtIclans Proposal to install new individual channel letter wall sign For a retail store which is part of an existing shopping center that is under a Unified business Center Sign plan. IV. ADJOURNMENT. DRAFT NOT APPROVED MEMBERS PRESENT: MEMBERS ABSENT: STAFF PRESENT: OTHERS PRESENT: CITIZEN COMMENT None MINUTES MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, August 10, 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 M. Larsen, J. Weiss, , L. Berkun, J. Macsai, C. Thomas None B. Fahlstrom I C. Smith Scott Pratt Greg Lamackf Peter Rodiguez Tony Janda Tom White Tom Kowalski 1" Presbyterian Church Firehouse Grill Firshouse Grill Wooden Sign Company I Firehouse Grill Arthur Hill &Company Kiku Obata & Company Chairman Larson opened the meeting at 7:05 p.m.. M. Larson motioned approval of the meeting minutes for the July 13, 2000 S.R.A.B. meeting. J. Macsai seconded and the minutes were unanimously approved. S.R.A.S. 8 00-23: 1427 Chlcaao Avenue — The 1" Presbvterian Church Mr. Scott Pratt representing the 1" Presbyterian Church presented the proposal for a free standing sign to the board. Mr Pratt explained that the sign would be a low wall 3 courses of brick with an upper facing of limestone and bronze metal lettering. The sign will be illuminated with 2 sunken light fixtures. Each fixture will produce 16-26 foot candies of even illumination. There will be 2 lights behind the sign to illuminate the existing flagpoles. M. Larson questioned if there was enough contrast between the limestone and the bronze ietters. Mr. Pratt produced samples of the bronze lettering and stated that a darker color of bronze would be use to ensure adequate contrast. A discussion followed on the lettering style. J. Weiss queried if there was any previous existing signage. M. Pratt noted that the existing older sign had been taken down. Mr. Pratt also that in the future additional directional signage would be added to the campus. Board members complimented Mr. Pratt on the design of the sign and the quality of the presntation. J. Weiss motioned approval of the sign as submitted. J. Macsai seconds and the motion passes unanlmousiv. SJ A.B. Meeting August 10, 2000 Page 2 S.R.A.B. SM24: 750 Chicago Avenue The Firehouse Grill Mr. Peter Rodriguez explained the sign proposal to the board. Mr. Rodriguez explained that a variation would be required for the north and south facing signs So that the building would be identified for north and south bound drivers. The south facing aigcr Would be mounted higher than allowed. Mr. Greg Lamacki (Mr. Rodriguez's partner in the restaurant) explained the scope of the architectural renovation to the board noting that the signs would be made of redwood to match the proposed wood finishes of the windows and doors. A general discussion followed with the board concerning various aspects of the architectural renovation. J. Weiss queried if there would be an outdoor eating area. Mr. Rodriguez stated that outdoor eating might happen in the future. J. Macsai motioned to approve the signs as submitted. Larson seconds and the motion tQ aPorove Passes unanimoushr. Public hearinq for S.R.A.B. 0 00-22 Sr ocial Sign District for The Church Street Plaza] Development. CRZZEN COMMENT Hone was made. An official transcript of this Public hearing was taken by a court Stenographer and will be added to this document when this court document is released to the Building Department NEXT MEETING: The next Meeting of the S.R.A.B. Board is scheduled for September 14, 2000. Robert Fahlstrom — Plans reviewer AGENDA SIGN REVIEW 3 APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, August 10, 2000 Evanston Civic Center — Room 2404. 7:00 P.M. 1. MINUTES Consideration to Approve of the meeting minutes of July 13, 2000. II. CITIZEN COMMENT Ill. NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. #00-23: 1427 Chicago Avenue, Proposal to install freestanding identification sign for the Ia' Presbyterian Church. S.R.A.B. #00-24: 7a0 Chicago Avenue Proposal to install wall signs for the new "Firehouse Restaurant" Public Hearing S.R.A.B. #00-22: Church Street Plaza This is the 2"d of 2 Public meetings to consider the request of the the Aurthur Hill LLC. For the creation of a 'Special Sion District' For the Church Street Plaza Development. The final decisions of the Sign Review and Appeals Board for this Special Sign District will be forwarded as recommendations to the City Council for the Council's final decision and vote on approval of this Special Sign District. IV. ADJOURNMENT. DRAFT NOT APPROVED MEMBERS PRESENT: MEMBERS ABSENT: STAFF PRESENT: OTHERS PRESENT: CITIZEN COMMENT None MINUTES MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, August 10.2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 M. Larsen, J. Weiss,, L Berkun, J. Macsal, C. Thomas None B. Fohlstrom f C. Smith Scott Pratt Greg Lamackl Peter Rodiguez Tony Jands Tom White Tom Kowalski 1'' Presbyterian Church Firehouse Grill Firehouse Grill Wooden Sign Company 1 Firehouse Grill Arthur Hill &Company Kiku Oltrata A Company Chairman Larson opened the meeting at 7:05 p.m.. M. Larson motioned approval of the meeting minutes for the July 13, 2000 S.R.A.B. meeting. J. Macsai seconded and the minutes were unanimously approved_ S.R.A.B. 0 00-23: 1427 Chicago Avenue —The 1" Presbvterlan Church Mr. Scott Pratt representing the 1" Presbyterian Church presented the proposal for a free standing sign to the board. Mr Pratt explained that the sign would be a low wall 3 courses of brink with an upper facing of limestone and bronze metal lettering. The sign will be illuminated with 2 sunken light fixtures. Each fixture will produce 16-26 foot candles of even illumination. There will be 2 lights behind the sVn to illuminate the existing flagpoles M. Larson questioned if there was enough contrast between the limestone and the bronze letters. Mr. Pratt produced samples of the bronze lettering and stated that a darker color of bronze would be use to ensure adequate contrast A discussion followed on the lettering style. J. Weiss queried if there was any previous existing signage M Pratt noted that the existing older sign had been taken down Mr. Pratt also that in the future additional directional signage would be added to the campus Board members complimented Mr. Pratt on the design of the sign and the quality of the presntation. J. Weiss motioned approval of the sign as submitted. J. Macsai seconds and the motion Dasses unanimousiv. S.RJLB. Meeting August 10, 2000 Page 2 S.R.A.S. NO-24: 750 Chicago Avenue The FMehouse QfW Mr. Peter Rodriguez explained the sign proposal to the board. Mr. Rodriguez explained that a variation would be required for the rQM and south facbV signs So that the building would be identified for north and south bound driVem. The south facing sign Would be mounted higher than allowed. Mr. Greg Lamadci (Mr. Rodriguez's partner in the restaurant) explained :he scope of the architectural renovation to the board noting that the signs would be mate of redwood to match the proposed wood finishes of the windows and doors. AgeneraldsM ion followed with the board concerning various aspects of the architectural renovation. J Weiss queried if there would be an outdoor eating area. Mr. Rodnguez stated that outdoor eating might happen in the future. .1 Macsai motioned to approve the signs as submitted. Larson seconds and the "WdOn to ygorove gasses unanlmoushr. Public hearina for S.R.A.S. 0 W22 aerial Sian Dlstrict for'The clench Street PM= Development. CITIZEN COMMENT None was made. An official transcript of this Public hearing was taken by a court Stenographer and will be added to this document when this court document Is released to the Building Department. NEXT MEETING: The next Meeting of the S.R.A.B. Board Is scheduled for Septernbesr 14, 2000. Robert Fahlstrom — Plans reviewer AGENDA SIGN REVIEW & APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, July 13, 2000 Evanston Civic Center -- Room 2404, 7:00 P.M. 1. MINUTES Consideration to Approve of the meeting minutes of June 8, 2000. Il. CITIZEN COMMENT Ill. NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. #00-19: 2040 Brown Street Presentation of proposal for a new free-standing low pedestal sign located on Brown Avenue for the Hill Arboretum Apartments. S.R.A.B. #00-20: 2636 Greenbav Road. Presentation of proposal to install a new wall sign for Enterprise Rent -a car to be located at 2636 Greenbay Road. S.R.A.B. #00-21: 818-824 Clark Street / 1729-43 Benson. Presentation of a Comprehensive Unified Sign proposal for the mercantile building located at the South east comer of Clark and Benson Streets. S.R.A.B. #00-22 : New Sian District for the Church Street Plaza Downtown Development. Presentation of the proposed Tenant sign criteria for the Church Street Plaza Development. IV. Discussion Item: Memorandum prepared by City Staff concerning additional meetings to discuss, review, and revise the Sign Ordinance. V. ADJOURNMENT. DRAFT NOT APPROVED MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, June 8, 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 MEMBERS PRESENT: M. Larsen, J. Weiss, C. Thomas, L. Berkun MEMBERS ABSENT: J. Macsal STAFF PRESENT: B. Fahlstrom OTHERS PRESENT: Ken Weiner and Daniel Grand of the Hearn Company Ed Weiss of The Aurora Sign Company Tom Rozzak of Roszack ADC OTHER BUSINES: None MINUTES Chairman Larsen declared a quorum at 7:30 p.m. Larsen motioned to approve the meeting minutes of May 11, 2000. J. Weiss stated that he wished to recommend a revision to the meeting minutes. Weiss explained the minutes should be revised to include the previous meeting's discussion about an earlier starting time for the S.R.AB. meeting. Weiss explained that a starting time of 6:00 p.m. had been proposed. This earlier starting time would allow for the discussion of two important topics: (1) Issues regarding how signs currently not in compliance with the Sign Ordinance would be brought into compliance after the current *grandfather provisions' for existing signs expires in 2003. (2) Proposed changes to the existing Sign Ordinance. The Board and City Staff agreed that the Minutes would be revised to reflect this previous discussion. City staff will consult with the Sign Board on when and how to implement this earlier meeting time. CITIZEN COMMENT None S.R.A.B. 00-16 1007 Church Street Mr Ken Kleiner began his presentation of the Hearn Company proposal by recounting the history of the flags in question at 1007 Church Street Mr. Kleiner explained that there are 4 exacting flag poles in front of the comer entry to 1007 Church Street and that the flag poles and flags have been existing since 1984 The flags, are approximately 4 feet by 6 feet and always include 1 United States Flag and 1 Cook County or City of Evanston Flag and 2 corporate flags Mr. Kleiner then explained that these corporate flags have been displayed since 1984, and that the management of the Hearn Company had assumed there was no problem in displaying these corporate flags They then received a phone call from Carolyn Smith staling that the flags were not in compliance with the Sign Ordinance. Mr. Kleiner stated that the corporate flags are architecturally and aesthetically pleasing and that displaying the corporate identity flags of the building's tenants is a perk he can offer to his tenants Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes — June 8, 2000 Page 2 of 4 Thomas stated that he wanted to air a complaint about matters such as these flags being brougN before the Sign Board. Thomas stated these are flags not signs and that regulating them was ludicrous. A certain aesthetic allowance should be granted unless the flags contained blatant advertising messages. M. Larsen agreed with Thomas. J. Weiss asked if having the option to have a corporate flag displayed was part of the lease agreement K. Kleiner stated that it was part of the lease agreement. Weiss then noted that the flags are 4 stories in the air and do not constitute a traffic hazard or a visual distraction. Thomas then proposed that the Sign Board could give the Hearn Company a criteria for Corporate flags such as allowing logos or names only and not allowing advertising copy. Weiss disagrees and states that many banners displayed in downtown Evanston have advertising copy Such as the banners currently hung from the downtown street light poles. Weiss states the board should approve variances for flags and banners on a case by case basis. Weiss motioned that the Board aaorove the Hearn Comaanv reauest with out anv restrictions. Larsen seconds and the motion passes unanimously S.R.A.B. 000-17 2953 Central Street Chris Thomas removed himseq from voting on this proposal because he was the design architect for this project. Thomas stated he would participate in the discussion to provide information to the Board. Ed Weiss of Aurora Signs presented the Unified Sign Plan Proposal for 2953 Central Street to the Board. Mr. Weiss explained that the drive through lane for the ATM machines is in back of the building at the north end of the site. This lane can only be accessed from Central Park, therefore, directional signage was required at the north end of the building to guide motorists to the access lane. Mr. Weiss also explained that the awnings extend four feet out from the face of the wall (one foot more than allowed by the Sign Ordinance). Mr. Weiss stated that this additional awning projection would provide better cover for the pedestrians, better thermal efficiency for the building. and give the building more of an old time appearance in keeping with the neighborhood. Thomas noted that the proposal did not include an entry canopy awning, This awning would be installed over the entry doors to the condominium lobby. This canopy for the residential lobby would be covered in a canvas to match the green canvas of the proposed retail awnings. Thomas stated he supported the general concept of the awning idea as appropriate for the building.. A general discussion was held to clanfy the traffic flow for the site. Thomas explained that the ATM machines had always been part of the design for the building, and that a drive through lane had even been required dunng construction so that customers of Bank One , who live in the in the area could access the ATt,A Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes June 8, 2000. Page 3 of, Weiss stated that he was unhappy with the presentation material from Aurora Signs Weiss noted that the booklet prepared by Aurora Signs contained only written descriptions of the sign proposal and small photographs showing the building with mocked up signs. The signs in the photographs were too small to be readable and no drawings or dimensional information on the signs was presented. Weiss noted that rt was hard to tell from the presentation what exactly they were voting for. Weiss questioned ff the bank identification sign shown centered over the ATM lane, which runs underneath the building at the eastern end of the site had a white background which would not be 04wab8e Mr. Weiss from Aurora Signs stated that the background for that specific sign was gray A general discussion followed on the dire=onal signs and what constitutes leased space and what was the intention of the Sign Ordinance in regard to co- terminus with the premises where the business is performed. J. Weiss asked if the awnings would be internally illuminated? E. Weiss and 8 Fahlstrom stated that the awnings were to be nonAlummated. L. Berkun asked for clarificabon for how the tenant space entries would work with the proposed awnings. A general discussion followed led by Thomas as to how the building tenant space is arranged and how the tenant awnings would work for a single tenant or for multiple tenants, A general discussion followed led by J Weiss on the size of the proposed identification sign letters at a height of 5 inches Weiss ncted that 5 inch high letters are visible from two hundred and fifty feet and that the traffic speed on Central Street is fairly slow so that the signs should be readable, Weiss notes that although he is disappointed with the presentation he would make a motion for acceptance. Thomas questions if the Board should set parameters for the future canopy over the residential entry Weiss motions for acceptance of the proposed Unrifled Business Sign Plan with no conditions. Berkun seconds the motion, and the motion passes unanimously. S.R.A.B. #00-18 Construction and Real Estate Sion. 1210-1238 Chicaao Avenue. J. Weiss removed himself from voting on this proposal because he had prepared the graphic design of the sign for Mr. Roszak Tom Roszak of Roszak ADC presented his proposal for a Real Estate Sign for his proposed development Chicago Avenue Place. Mr Roszak handed out a revised version of the proposal for the sign he wished to install Roszak explained that the sign's new dimensions would be sixteen feet and 5 inches high by twenty-four feet wide. These dimensions would enable the sign to conceal a double construction trailerlsales office. The sign and sales trailer would be positioned at the south end of the property Mr. Roszak stated that he knew the proposed sign was larger than allowed, and that it had more items of information than is allowed, but ails sign would also incorporate some state of the art computer technology. Mr. Roszak explained that at the south corner of the sign, a 2 foot x 2 foot cutout would be provided in the sign with a flush mounted T.V monitor displaying computer images of the project exterior and the some interior units. A large arrow mounted to the sign would point to this T.V. Screen. Mr Roszak also explained that he understood that the sign would require a variance for the amount of time d would be up. To accommodate the anticipated construction schedule and phasing for the whole project. Sign Review 3 Appeals Board Meeting Minutes, June 8, 2000. Page 4 of 4 B. Fahtstrom explained to the Board that the T.V. with computer images could possibly require additional variances from the Sign Ordinance. The variances would be far the ctiangeable copy portion of the Sign Ordinance and also for those portions of the Ordinance that require that signs cannot constitute traffic hazards or have movable portions. Thomas stated his three comments for this proposed sign. (I. The portion of the sign that states 'Be first' screams for attention. (2. The logo is well designed. (3. The arrow pointing to the T.V. screen should be larger. Larsen asked what would be the hours of opeMion for the computerized sales images to be shown on the T.V.. Roszak replies probably 8 a.m. to 9 p.m. Mr. Roszak added that the sign will not be made of wood but made of fabc= stretched over aluminum tubes. Mr. Roszak said this sign weld be extremely attractive A general discussion followed with J. Weiss expianing how he arrived at tus design for 'Chicago Avenue Place' logo. L. Berkun notes that she has concerns with T.V. video images causing a traffic hazard. Berkun stated that a much larger version of this video conceit was tried in Chicago at the Tree Studios on State Street and that this particular video sign was a real distraction to drivers. Larsen countered that he fei* that the sale of this T.V t Video monitor is appropriate only for foot traffic and wouldn't cons=e a traffic hazard. L. Berkun noted that this sign might become an attractive target for vandals or graffiti. Mr. Roszak noted that his construction projects have had good success with their signs not being vandalized and that this sign would be maintained, repaired, or replaced if vandalism occurred. Thomas motions to accept this proposal without modification. L. Berkun seconds, and the motion passes unanimously. ADJOURNMENT Hearing no other business, Chairman Larsen motioned adjournment at 8:35. NEXT MEETING The next meeting of the S.R.A.B. is scheduled for Thursday July 13, 2000. Bob Fahistrom, Plan Examiner Community Development — Building Division Cc: J. Wolinski C. Smith K. Mims AGENDA SIGN REVIEW & APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, June 8, 2000 Evanston Civic Center — Room 2404, 7:30 P.M. I. MINUTES Consideration to Approve of the meeting minutes of May 11, 2000. 11. CITIZEN COMMENT Ill. NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. #00-16: 1007 Church Street Exterior Plaza. Proposal to display commercial flags at exterior plaza. S.R.A.B. #00-17: 2953 Central Street. , Presentation of Comvrehensive Business Center Sian Packane for the retail portion of a new Condominium Building. S.R.A.B. #00-18: 1210-1238 Chicago Avenue. Proposal to install a freestanding Real Estate Sign for a future real estate development "Chicago Avenue Place'. IV. ADJOURNMENT. DRAFT NOT APPROVED MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, " 11, 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 MEMBERS PRESENT: M. Laren, J. MacsaL J. Weiss, and C. Thomas MEMBERS ABSENT: L. Berkun STAFF PRESENT: C. Smith OTHERS PRESENT: Frank Karkasis, DDS and M.r. David Brownly of Chlcgo Sign-1029fi101 Howard Medical Bundling, Kwang YI — Clover Signs for Sushi Arigato, Jessie Roman — Spax Car Wash, Jim Denmark — Sure Light Sign Company for Sam's Club OTHER BUSINESS: None MINUTES Chairman Larsen declared a quorum and opened the meeting at 7:35 p,m. Thomas motioned to approve the meeting minutes of the April 13, 2000 meeting, seconded by Macasi. The meeting minutes of the April 13, 2000 meeting were approved, 4-0. CITIZEN COMMENT None OLD BUSINESS S.RJLB. 0 00-10: Sushi Arfasto. 822 Clark After being previously tabled by the Sign Review and Appeals Board at the Apnil 13, 2000 meeting, Mr. Kwan, who corrected the previous understanding of the Board by stating that he is the sign contractor, not the business owner, was present Macasi then questioned Mr. Kwan why a sign was installed without the required permit? Mr. Kwan responded that he had discussed with the business owner that the business owner was required to obtain the permit, and had proceeded under that assumption. As per the comments from the previous meeting where the issue had been tabled as a result of the Board questioning the existence of a Unified Business Center Pian (see meeting minutes of 4113/00). City staff included a copy of the previously approved business plan (February, 1989) which had no pervision for any awnings This plan was later amended, to allow for an awning for a specific restaurant, but did not allow for an amendment for awnings everywhere. Thomas commented on the basis of the overall Unified Business Center Plan, it does not conform. Macasi commented that the original plan had foresight and planned locations for architecturally appropriate signage. To regulate this sort of orange individually should be unacceptable. Weiss commented that what had been done at this property has been reasonably acceptable, but we need to get an overall concept for the center from the owner, not each tenant. Weiss motions to deny. and sunaested that the owner of the center propose an overall concept for amendina the oreviousiv approved Unffieaf Busimms Center Plan that could be reviewed and approved by the Board. This motion was seconded and approved 4-0. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes — May 11, 2000 Page 2 of 4 S.R.A.B. 9 00-11: Jimmv John's. 824 Clark As this property is adjacent to the previous case (see S.R.A_B #0010) the same comments apply, Hlluiss motions to denv. and suq,Qested that the owner of the center or000se an overall conceat_ig amending the oreviously approved Unf ed Buslnass Center Pfan that cnukf be reviiewed and a by the Board. This motion was seconded and aooroved 44. NEW BUSINESS S.RA.B. 4 00-13: 1101 Medical Buildinq. 1029 & 1101 Howard Street Mr. David Brownty of Chicago Signs presented the proposal. He stated that the reason for mounting the freestanding sign so high is to allow pedestrian and vehicular traffic to have adequate vision. Although the proposal submitted indicates a white background, he proposed to the Board that he would construct a sign with a dark bronze background with routed white letters to avoid conflict with the Sign Ordinance. Dr. Karkasis, the owner of the property and the business. stated that the biggest problem he has is identifying the property as a medical office building He went on to say that he accepts many people on public aid, and tliey have a difficult time finding the building, The Board then discussed the 2 proposed wall signs. The Board questioned the need for all of the names on the signs and that the signs do not even look the same, although this property is trying to be joined together by signage The Board members commented that at the size shown, nobody would be reading it until they would be up to the door. Weiss questioned if the submitted photo montage was in the correct proportion, as it was not proportionate with the height of the door. Tha applicant claimed it was Macasi stated that the free standing sign will serve to get people to the correct building from both directions, but a 12' long wail sign with the Doctor's names on it is excessive. 1 could never vote in favor of such a sign. Weiss commented that if it is big enough to be seen from the street, it is too big for this kind of signage Chairman Larsen agreed by stating that he hears the biggest problem being to get people off of the street Macasi motioned to approved the freestanding sion as submitted onlv with an ooaaue backvround, centered In the existina Island. Thomas seconded. and the motion is approved 4-0. Thomas then motioned to deny the watt sianane. Macasi seconded. and the motion to denv the wall slonsue was approved 4-0. S.R.A.B. 4 00-14: Snex Car Wash. 2212 Greenbay Road Jessie Roman, of Spex Car Wash presented their proposal for a wall sign on the north side of their building. Mr. Roman stated that they have a problem with identtfying their business to south bound traffic. C. Smdh clarified that the City of Evanston's position is that no permit shall be issued for anything over the property fine, and already, according to the submitted plat of survey for the adjacent property, the building itself is over eve property line. An easement agreement would need to be filed with the recorder of deeds to have this sign permitted, even if the Sign Review and Appeals Board would approve it. Macasi commented that the sign letters should be flush left as the centered letters appears awkward. Weiss added that he would agree that the centered lettering kooks odd, but would suggest flush right with the anew. Thomas added that he thinks that there is too much space between the two words, and that would reduce the overall area of the signage. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes — May 11, 2000 Page 3 of 4 After some discussion, Macasi moved to approve the submitted sign subiect to the filing Of an easement agreement on the adlacent property. and that the letters be flushed right. Weiss ser;.oeded and the motion was approved 4-0. Subsequent to this motion, the applicant requested rf the Board could consider expanding their approval to include illuminating the sign. The Board discussed this request, and Weiss motioned to approve the siren as earlier limited. adding illumination. Macasi seconded. and the motion did not pass by a tie vote of 2-2. S.R.A.B. 0 00-15: Sam's Club. McCormick a Main Street Mr. Jim Denmark of Sure Light Sign Co. presented the proposal for his client, Sam's Club. Mr. Denmark clarified that the only illuminated signs in the proposal are the 2 rotated square signs that say 'Sam's Club'. All other signs are non -illuminated plastic letters. Chairman Larsen questioned if the Board had any comments regarding the 6' x 6' sign over the pediment? Macasi stated that he is does not like the "levitating' positioning of the sign Mr Denmark responded that this sign placement was necessitated by the surface of the pediment not being level. They then decided to locate the sign above the pediment Weiss asked the applicant if this could be reduced in size, even to a 4' x 4' size? Mr. Denmark responded that the 6' x 6' size is the smallest in the sign program for Sam's Club. Macasi questioned the need for this sign at all, when they are also proposing a 13' x 13' sign on the same elevation that says the same thing. Chairman Larsen added that this additional sign dilutes the signage, Weiss motions to approve the proposal. without the 6' x 6' sign at the entry. The motion Is seconded by Thomas. and approved 4-0. DISCUSSION ITEM Weiss suggested to the Board that with the proposed end of the amortization period ending in 2 'A years (January 1, 2003). the Board needs to be ready to handle the onslaught of business owner's that will appeal to the City Council to rescind the ordinance. C. Smith commented that the board may want to consider some changes in the Sign Ordinance prior to the enforcement of the Ordinance, as there are many items that the Board has stated over the years that need to be updated in the Ordinance. After much discussion by the Board. it was agreed that the sequence of the events should be as follows: 1 The Board should convene regularly to review the Ordinance for desired changes. Assistance for the process is requested from the Planning Division. as the Sign Ordinance should be compatible with brie City's Comprehensive Plan. 2. The proposed changes must be reviewed and approved by the City Council, 3. Additional staff should be hired to survey the existing signage relative to the revised Sign Ordinance and notification should be given to all businessr'property owners notifying them that their signage is not in complainance with the City's Sign Ordinance, and will need to be altered or an appeal applied for. 4. This entire process will take longer than the proposed 2 '/: year time line, currently in effect. The end of the amortization time period should be extended (2 years?) to accomplish these goals. This should be included in the changes to the Sign Ordinance that gets reviewed and approved by the City Council. ADJOURNMENT Hearing no other business, Chairman Larsen motioned adjournment at 9: 15 p.m. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes — May 11, 2000 Page 4 of 4 NEXT MEETING The next meeting of the SAAB. is scheduled for Thursday. June 8, 2000. Carolyn Smith, Assistant Director Community Development • Building Division cc: J. Woiinski K Mims Ll AGENDA SIGN REVIEW & APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY. MAY 11. 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER - ROOM 2404, 7:30 P.M. L MINUTES Consideration to approve of the meeting minutes of April 13. 2000. A CITIZEN COMMENT 111. OLD BUSINESS S.R.A.B. # 00-10: Sushi Ariaato. 822 Clark Proposal to approve awning signage installed without permit. S.R.A.B. # 00-11: Jimmv John's. 824 Clark Proposal to approve awning signage installed without permit. IV. NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. # 00-13: 1101 Medical Buildina. 1029 i3 1101 Howard Street Proposal to install a wall sign and free standing sign. S.R.A.B. # 00-14: Snex Car Wash. 2212 Greenbav Road Proposal to install a wall sign S.R.A.B. # 00-15: Sam's Club, McCormick S Main Street Proposal to install several illuminated and non -illuminated wall signs. V. DISCUSSION ITEM All commercial signage within the City shall be in compliance with the Sign Ordinance by January 1, 2003. Jack Weiss wishes to discuss the end of the amortization of non -conforming signage. W. ADJOURNMENT xl DRAFT NOT APPROVED MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, April 13, 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 MEMBERS PRESENT: M. Larsen, L. Berkun, J. Weiss, and C. Thomas MEMBERS ABSENT: J. Maceal STAFF PRESENT: C. Smith OTHERS PRESENT: Carl Dlssette - Jimmy John's, Bemis Woytek - Griskefis + Smith for Citibank, Teresa Faidley and Kirk Admire - Citibank, Teaser J. Doyle - Doyle Sign Co. for Dominick's, James Uckerman - Dominick% Kwang Yi - Sushi Arigato. David Loveland - Evanston Nortlnivestem Healthcare, Alan Schwimmer - Rocket Design for Evanston Northwestem Healthcare, Michael Freeman - Jamerson Realty OTHER BUSINESS: None. MINUTES Chairman Larsen declared a quorum and opened the meeting at 7:33 p.m. Thomas motioned to approve the meeting minutes of the February 10, 2000 meeting, seconded by L Berkun. The meeting minutes of the February 10, 2000 meeting were approved, 4-0. CITIZEN COMMENT None NEW BUSINESS S.RA.B. 0 00-05: Dominick's. DemDsterlDodoe Plaza After being previously tabled by the Sign Review and Appeals Board at the February 10, 2000 meeting, Mr. Doyle of Doyle Sign Company presented the revised proposal. The difference between the previars submittal and this version are as follows: 1. The overall size of the Dominck's sign has been reduced such that it meets the 200 SF li n%u 2. The size of the capital letter in the word *Dominick's* has been reduced from 5.5' to 5' high 3. The words 'Food' and "Drug" are now located together to the west of the Dominick's sign Chairman Larsen comments that the issue of the fagade projecting has been resolved, and tf•.at the metal portion does project forward and the Dominick's signage is centered in the EIFS space. Chairman Larsen clarifies that the letters for the DominicKs sign are more expanded than the previous submittal. Mr. Doyle responds that additional space around the letters make this sign more readable, and it still falls within the Sign Ordinance required 200 SF maximum. Thomas motions to aDDrove the Droaosal as currenthr submitted. Berkun seconds this oration. The motion is aoDroved 4-0. f Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes April 13, 2000 Page 2 of 4 S.R.A.B. 0 00-08: Evanston Northwestern Healthcare. 1000 Central Mr Alan Schwimmer, of Rocket Design, representing Evanston Nor&*,estem Healthcare, presented the proposal. He stated that the hospital has had a large donation from a Mr Graham, and promised to kxu tt his name prominently on the 1000 Central Street building, essentially renaming it. Thomas asked Mr. Schwimmer what the building is currently called The response was 'TOW Central'. Weiss commented that after calculating the area of the proposed signage, even the existing graphic elements exceed the allowable 15% of sign area. Weiss states that the overall effect of the existing and proposed signage, covering 85% of the canopy, is excessive. Weiss questioned staff on when this variation for the existing signage had been approved. C. Smith responded that she would investigate, but the canopy did receive a variation for signage some years earlier. Mr. Schwinin r stated that they did receive a permit to install the current signage. Mr. Schwimmer stated that the current signage (Using the current Northwestern Healthcare' named and logo at each side of the canopy) refteected a reduction in what had been previously installed. (Subsequent to the meeting, C. Smith found a vanabon application and approval of signage in January, 1994 which allowed for signage covering 40% of the canopy area.) Chairman Larsen queries the Board if they would consider locating the proposed new signage ('Graham Medical Office Building") beneath the existing canopy, where the street number ('1000') is currently being proposed The street number could remain in its' current location on the center of the canopy. The Board responded with favorable comments, stating that this would allow a more "expensive and permanent looking solution of incised limestone (or concrete) panels. This kx;abon would allow for illumination of the narne by the existing recessed lights in that location. The applicants were receptive to this idea, and with that, Chairman Larsen motioned for denial of the variation and Weiss seconded. The motion was approved 4-0. Chairman Larsen motioned to approve the existing canopy sicinaae as installed, and to Instail the "Graham Medical Office Buildina" letterinq in the area beneath the canoov. This motion was seconded by Weiss and approved 4-0. S.R.A.B. 0 00-09: Condo Conversion. 820-22 Seward Mr. Freeman of Jamerson Realty, presented the proposal for this sign. which was erected without a permit Chainnan Larsen explained to the applicant why the "items of information' is a problem, and stated that the height and area of the sign is fine The other problem is the issue of no signage in a residential area. Weiss questioned the applicant about why the sign was erected without permV Mr Freeman responded that his past condo conversion experience has all been in Chicago, and he wasn't aware that a permit is required for this type of temporary sign in Evanston. Thomas suggested that if the applicant would remove the information contained within the "box' in the center of the sign, it would minimize the 'items of information' issue, and improve the overall sign. Weiss suggested then that the top and bottom piece of the sign could then be joined together. The other Board numitiers agreed k Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes —April 13, 2000 Page 3 of 4 Weiss motioned for aoaroval of the existnM sign for a Period not to exceed 12 months, and designated that the Information rontainod within the box In the center of the si4n be removed. and the two Pieces (toff and bottom) be iolned. thus lowerinil the Sion trf aPProximatehr 2'. This motbrt was seconded by Berkun. and was approved 4-0. S.R.A.S. # 00-10: Sushi Arloato. 822 Clark Chamman Larsen reviewed the issues with Mr. Kwan, the owner of Sushi Angato. The Board discussed I the awning also hides an "architectural feature' in addition to the items cited in the memo accompanying the appeal. Weiss suggested that this was a previously approved Unified Business Center Sign Plan, and asked if the Board would consider tabling this appeal until this could be determined Thomas responded that by motioning to table this appeal until staff could determine If a Unfired Business Center Sign Plan has been recorded. This motion was seconded by Berkun, and approved 4-0. S.RA.8. * 00-11: Jimmy John's, 824 Clark Mr. Cart Dissette, the owner of Jimmy John's, stated that he realizes that it is his responsibility to obtain permits. He had hired Evanston Awning, a local business, trusting that in good faith they would do what needed to be done with City approvals. The Board then discussed that, as with the previous appeal (S.RAS. #00-11), this project would also fall under a previously approved Unified Business Center Sign Plan, if one had been approved on this property. Thomas motioned to table this appeal until staff could determine If a Unh7ed Business Center Sion Plan has been recorded. This motion was seconded by Berkun, and approved 4-0. S.RA.8 #00-12: Citibank, 817 Church Mr Bernie Woytek presented the proposal Mr Woytek explained that Citibank is relocating to this building from Davis and Sherman They currently have over 600 SF of signage at the Davis and Sherman location. Citibank is concerned about the mid -block location Their Evanston is currently one of the largest in the 52 branch banks that Citibank has. They hope to grow even further in this Iocabon Thomas questions why Citibank should be granted a variation over the other businesses in that mid -block situation. Mr. Woytek states that Citibank is spending over $75,000 to dean up the canopy. They will be time first business that will actually restore the window frames to the existing look Mr Woytek comments that the Preservation Commission, when reviewing this proposal, was very happy about the discreet signage at the canopy The Preservation Commission gave a unanimous approval. Mr. Woytek also added that in the previous 5 years, there have been many stores that have tried to occupy this space, but have failed to gain the necessary exposure. Weiss stated that it is admirable what you are proposing to do to the building, and impressive that the Preservation Commission gave a unanimous approval. Berkun asked the applicants if they are proposing any graphics or signage on the flags? Mr. Admire, of Citibank, responded that they hope to have the new Citibank logo, as Citibank has merged with Travelers Insurance, but they can't be definitive with the Sign Board about what this will took like, as it is not yet available But, Citibank is very discreet, and would not do anything out of proportion or distasteful. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes -April 13, 2000 Page 4of4 Weiss asks when Citibank plans to occupy this new space? Ms. Faidley of Citibank, states that they tope to occupy the space by September 1, 2000. Chairman Larsen asks the Board what they think about the wall sign on the west elevation of the building? Weiss comments that he has a problem with the fact that it Is not coterminous and the height. Mr. Woytek explains that it cannot be lowered based on the one story building to the west Also, Citibank would like the visibility from the trains. Chairman Larsen states that the signage under the canopy and the flags would seem to be enough to idendify this location from the west, or east for that matter. Thomas motions to approve the dr000sal. with the exceotion of the wall sion on the west eiwatlon. Weiss seconds, and the motion I$ annroved with a vote of 4-0. ADJOURNMENT Hearing no other business, Chairman Larsen motioned adjournment at 9: 00p.m. NEXT MEETING The next meeting of the S.R.AB. is scheduled for Thursday. May 11, 2000. Carolyn SmC"�IAsslstan�tl)l rector Community Development - Building Division cc: J. Wolinski K. Mims AGENDA SIGN REVIEW & APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY. APRILI3. 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER - ROOM 2404, 7:30 P.M. 1. MINUTES Consideration to approve of the meeting minutes of February 10, 2000. Il. CITIZEN COMMENT III. NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. # 00-05: Dominick's. Demaster/ Dodee Plaza Proposal to install illuminated wall signs. (Previously tabled) S.R.A.B. # 00-08: Evanston Northwestern Healthcare. 1000 Central Proposal to install non -illuminated canopy signage. S.R.A.B. # 00-09: Condo Conversion. 820-22 Seward Proposal to install a temporary, non -illuminated freestanding real estate sign. S.R.A.B. # 00-10: Sushi Arinato. 822 Clark Proposal to approve awning signage installed without permit. S.R.A.B. # 00-11: Jimmv John's. 824 Clark Proposal to approve awning signage installed without permit. S.R.A.B. # 00-12: Citibank. 817 Church Proposal to install flags, illuminated wall signage, and an illuminated canopy sign. IV. ADJOURNMENT DRAFT NOT APPROVED MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, February 10, 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 MEMBERS PRESENT: M. Larsen, L. Berkun, J. Macsal MEMBERS ABSENT: J. Weiss, C. Thomas STAFF PRESENT: C. Smith OTHERS PRESENT: Arthur Holland — Marathon Gas Co., Terrence J. Doyle - Doyle Sign Co. for Dominick's, Coleman J. Joyce — Baird a Warner OTHER BUSINESS: None. MINUTES Chairman Larsen declared a quorum and opened the meeting at 7:30 p.m. Macsai motioned to approve the meeting minutes of the January 13, 2000 meeting, seconded by L. Berkun. The meeting minutes of the January 13, 2000 meeting were approved, 3-0. CITIZEN COMMENT None NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. 0 00-04: Marathon Gas Station, 555 Howard Chairman Larsen suggested beginning the review with the canopy. Mr. Holland presents the proposal for the canopy Mr. Holland clarifies that contrary to the submitted information, the canopy will not be illuminated, even by external lighting. This statement eliminates the comment indicated in the packet Also, Mr. Holland clanfies that the Marathon name will only be on the east and west elevation of the canopy. Macasi comments that the phrase `Best in the Long Run' is superfluous. He continues by stating that no one purchases gasoline on this basis; they purchase gasoline based on price. Chairman Larsen asks the applicant if the reason for the canopy height is based on the requirement that trucks must pass underneath. This was confirmed by Mr. Holland Chairman Larsen questions the other board members to see if anyone has a problem with the 'Marathon lettering on both the east and west side of the canopy Macasi comments that traffic on Howard is fast moving, and the lettering makes sense on both sides of the canopy. With that comment. Macasi moves for approval of the non -illuminated canopy with only the word "Marthon" on both the east and west elevation. This motion is seconded by Berkun, and approved 3-0. Next, the Board discussed the free standing sign. Macasi comments that the phrase 'Pay at the Pump' and all the credit card logos are redundant; anyone can see this by looking at the pump. This should be eliminated. Berkun and Larsen commented that the height of the bottom of this sign is not critical for the concern of site lines, as it is basically against the railroad embankment, although the reader board sign is unnecessary. Larsen motioned approval of the freestanding sign, at a maximum height of 15'-s", without the "Pay at the Pump" and credit cards logos, and without the reader board portion. This motion was seconded by Macasi, and approved, 3-0. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes — February 10, 2000 Page 2 of 3 S.RA.B. # 00-05: Dominick's. DempsterJDodae Plana Mr. Doyle presented a proposal to vary from the previously approved Urtrhed Business Center sign plan, by installing new wall signage. Macasi questions the submated elevations, as it is not apparent where the swped portion of the elevation begins Mr. Doyle was unclear, and could not answer Macasi's question Chairman Larsen comments that the signage seems top heavy, filling up the space above the area that appears to be sloped Mr. Doyle stated that it must be seen above the parking area to the north. Chairman Larsen responded that the proposed signage is illuminated, and that he is concerned with the residential across the street on Dodge. Macasi adds that if the 'Dominick's' sign must be readable, then eliminate the 'Bank One', 'Food', and 'Drugs" signage. Why. Macasi conbnues, say 'Food' when everybody knows that Dominick's is a food store? Mr. Doyle responds that this other signage makes the elevation more balanced, and that the total sign surface area is less than allowed Berkun asks the applicant if there is Dominick's signage on the 2 free standing signs that face Dodge and Dempster. Mr. Doyle responds yes Macasi commented that if the size of the lowercase letter does not exceed 30', he would approve. There was further discussion regarding the location of the sloped portion of the fagade Macasi motions to table the proposal, pendinq resolve of the elevation, which Is seconded by Berkun. The motion Is approved 3-0. S.R.A.B. # 00-06: Baird & Warner Condominium Conversion, 417-25 Custer Mr. Joyce. a realtor for Baird & Warner, presented this proposal for an non -illuminated temporary sign for a condominium conversion. After a short discussion clarifying the overall height, Macasi stated that he had no problem with the text and color, but the height must be kept to an overall height of 5-11)'. Chairman Larsen noted that the site is slightly sloped. If you want a car to read this sign, he continued, you must organize the information such that the important stuff is on the top Macaai motioned for approval of the pr000sal for a oerind not to exceed 12 months, and desiqnated that the slanaQe may not be higher than V-0. This motion was seconded by Larsen, and approved 3-0. S.R.A.B. # 00-07: Baird & Warner Condominium Conversion, 815 Reba Place Mr. Joyce presented the proposal for this sign, which will be mounted 5-0' to the top. Berkun commented that it is difficult to read, as everything has the same line weight, and suggested that this be revised. Macsai motioned for approval of the proposal for a period not to exceed 12 months, and designated that the signage may not be higher than 5'-0. This motion was seconded by Larsen, and approved 3-0. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes — February 10, 2000 Page 3 of 3 ADJOURNMENT Hearing no other business, Chairman Larsen motioned adjournment at 8: 40p.m. NEXT MEETING The next meeting of the S.R.AB. is scheduled for Thursday, March 9. 2000. (This meeting was subsequerd y cancelled, and the next meeting is now scheduled flor Thursday. Awil 13. 20W) Carolyn Smith, As nt Director ` Community Development - Building Division cc: J. Wolinski K. Mims DRAFT NOT APPROVED MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, February 10, 2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 MEMBERS PRESENT: M. Larsen, L. Berkun, J. Macsal MEMBERS ABSENT: J. Weiss, C. Thomas STAFF PRESENT: C. Smith OTHERS PRESENT: Arthur Holland — Marathon Gas Co., Terrence J. Doyle - Doyle Sign Co. for Dominick's, Coleman J. Joyce -- Baird a Warner OTHER BUSINESS: None. MINUTES Chairman Larsen declared a quorum and opened the meeting at 7:30 p.m. Macaai motioned to approve the meeting minutes of the January 13, 2000 meeting, seconded by L. Berkun. The meeting minutes of the January 13, 2000 meeting were approved, 3-0. CITIZEN COMMENT None NEW BUSINESS S.RA.B. 4 00-04: Marathon Gas Station. 555 Howard Chairman Larsen suggested beginning the review with the canopy. Mr. Holland presents the proposal for the canopy. Mr. Holland clarifies that contrary to the submitted information. the canopy will not be illuminamed, even by external lighting. This statement eliminates the comment indicated in the packet. Also, Mr. Holand clarifies that the Marathon name will only be on the east and west elevation of the canopy. Macasi comments that the phrase 'Best in the Long Run' is superfluous. He continues by stating that no one purchases gasoline on this basis; they purchase gasoline based on price. Chairman Larsen asks the applicant if the reason for the canopy height is based on the requirement that trucks must pass underneath. This was confirmed by Mr. Holland. Chairman Larsen questions the other board members to see if anyone has a problem with the 'Marathon' lettering on both the east and west side of the canopy. Macasi convreer is that traffic on Howard is fast moving, and the lettering makes sense on both sides of the canopy. Vft V= comment. Macasi moves for approval of the non -Illuminated canopy with only the word "Marthon" on both the east and west elevation. This motion is seconded by Berkun, and approved 3-0. Next, the Board discussed the freestanding sign. Macasi comments that the phrase "Pay at the Pump' and all the credit card logos are redundant; anyone can see this by looking at the pump. This should be eliminated. Berkun and Larsen commented that the height of the bottom of this sign is not critical for the concern of site lines, as it is basically against the railroad embankment, although the reader board sign is unnecessary. Larsen motioned approval of the freestanding sign, at a maximum height of 159-0', without the "Pay at the Pump" and credit cards logos, and without the reader board portion. This motion was seconded by Macasi, and approved, 3-0. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes — February 10, 2000 Page 2 of 3 S.RA.B. a 00-05: Dominick's. DempsterfOodas Ptm Mr. Doyle presented a proposal to vary from the previously approved UniSed Business Center sign piam, by installing new wail signage Macasi questions the rubrroled elevations, as it is not apparent where the slipped portion of the elevation bajins Mr. Doyle was unclear. and could not answer Macasi's question. Chairman Larsen comments that the signage seems 4op heavy. filling up the space above the area heat appears to be sloped. Mr Doyle stated that it must be 9.een above the parking area to the north. Chairman Larsen responded that the proposed signage is illuminated, and that he is concerned with the reside+rdal across the street on Dodge Macasi adds that if the 'Dominick's* sign must be readable, then eliminate the "Bank One', 'Food", and 'Drugs" signage. Why, Macasi continues, say *Food' when everybody knows that Dominick's is a food wore? Mr. Doyle responds that this other signage makes the elevation more balanced, and that the total sign surface area is less than allowed. Berkun asks the applicant if there is Dominick's signage on the 2 free standing signs that face Dodge and Dempster. Mr. Doyle responds yes. Macasi commented that if the size of the lowercase letter does not exceed 30'. he would approve. there was further discussion regarding the location of the sloped portion of the facade. Aflacaal motkma to table the proposal. pending resofve of the elevation, which is seconded by 6erknn. The motion is approved 3-0. SAA.B. * 00-06: Baird & Wamer Condominium Conversion, 417-25 Custer Mr Joyce. a realtor for Baird & Warner, presented this Proposal for an non -illuminated temporary sign ibr a condominium conversion After a short discussion clarifying the overall height. Macasi stated that he had no problem with the text and color, but the height must be kept to an overall height of 5-0-. Chairman Larsen noted that the site is slig" sloped. If you want a car to read this sign, he continued, you must organize the information such that the important stuff is on the top Maesal motioned for approval of the proposal for a period not to exceed 12 months, and desianated that the slanane may not be higher than 5'-0. This motion was seconded by Larsen, and approved 3-0. SAA.B. 0 00-07: Baird a Warner Condominium Conversion, 815 Reba Place Mr. Joyce presented the proposal for this sign, which w:Q be mounted 5-0' to the top. Berkun commented that it is difficult to read, as everything has the same line weight, and suggested that this be revised. Magsall motioned for approval of the proposal for a period not to exceed 12 months, and deaianated that the signage may not be higher than W-0. This motion was seconded by Larsen, and approved 3-0. Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes — February 10, 2000 Page 3 of 3 ADJOURNMENT Hearing no other business, Chalrman Larsen motioned adjournment at 8: 40p.m. NEXT MEETING The next meeting of the S.R.AB. is scheduled for Thursday, March 9, 2000. (This meeting was subsegraentty cancelled, and the next meeting is now scheduled for Thunsday. April 13.2000.) Carolyn Smith, Assistant Director Community Development - Building Division cc: J. Wolinski K Mims AGENDA SIGN REVIEW & APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY. January 13.2000 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER - ROOM 2404, 7:30 P.M. 1. MINUTES Consideration of approval of meeting minutes of December 9, 1999. II. CITIZEN COMMENT 111. NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. # 00-01: Office Max PDQ. 1633 Chicago Ave. Proposal to install 2 illuminated non -conforming wall signs. S.R.A.B. # 00-02: Spex Car Wash. 1235 Dodae Ave. Proposal to install an illuminated non -conforming wail sign. S.R.A.B. # 00-03: Swan/Arthur Development. 1935 Sherman Ave. Proposal to install a temporary, non -illuminated freestanding real estate sign. IV. ADJOURNMENT t DRAFT NOT APPROVED MINUTES SIGN REVIEW AND APPEALS BOARD THURSDAY, DECEMBER 9, 1999 EVANSTON CIVIC CENTER, ROOM 2404 MEMBERS PRESENT: M. Larson, J. Weiss, L. Berkun MEMBERS ABSENT: C. Thomas (additionally, one position on Board to vacant) STAFF PRESENT: C. Smith OTHERS PRESENT: Virginia Campion of Vincent Sign Co. for Osco Drug, Bill Smith for Great Bank, James T. Murray and Carol Cooney for The Cos Building, amd Buzz Kaehler of Kaehler Inc. OTHER BUSINESS: None. MINUTES Chairman Larson declared a quorum and opened the meeting at 7:33 p.m. L. Berkun motioned to approve the meeting minutes of the November 11,1999 meeting, seconded by J. Weiss. The meeting minutes of the November 11, 1999 were approved, 3-0. CITIZEN COMMENT Mr. Gordon McGrew of 2505 Ridge Ave. was present to review the proposed variation procedure for 99-18 for the Cos Building at 2500 Ridge Ave. NEW BUSINESS S.R.A.B. # 99-15: Osco Druq. 430 Asbury Virginia Campione of Vincent Sign Co. representing Osco Drug explains the request for variation is for the mounting height for the wall signs. Ms. Campione illustrated, with a submitted drawing, if her Client was required to comply with the City Ordinance, the signage would look out of proportion with the building. J. Weiss stated that he is in agreement with the proposed mounting height of the signage, with one exception. That exception is the wall sign on the north elevation that says `Food Mart —1-hour Photo', which sixld be mounted at 15'-6' to the top. The rest of the board agreed, stating that this would look better on that elevation, than up any higher. J. Weiss then motioned to arant aonroval of the aroaosal. contingent upon the north facirm skLn "Food Mart—1-hour photo sign be mounted such that [sat 15'-t3" at the ton. M. Larson seconded, and the motion was unanimousty aaoroved, 3-0. Subsequent to the motion, J. Weiss questioned the height and location of the proposed free standing monument sign at the comer of Oakton and Asbury. Ms. Campione clarified that what is proposed is a box sign that sits on top of the stone base that has already been installed. C. Smith then stated that this was not Gear in the permit application submitted, and informed Mr. Campione that this would not be allowed vA hin the It Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes —December 9, 1999 Page 2 of 3 ordinance. A discussion then ensued regarding the options available. The discussion centered on the new Jewel/Osco sign in Wilmette. The sign for that store, it was stated, is an attractive ground lit sign with -mew letters incised in the stone The hoard felt that this type of signage, or metal letters that would 'float an the existing stone base would match the subtly of the building design J. Weiss then motioned to denv the rxnnnr+ri monument sign (shown on the drawings submitted for variation dated 11/10199). This motion was seconded by L Berkun, and passed unanimoustv 3-0. S.R.A.B. # 99-16: Mindscaoe Adornments. 2114 Central Ave. No one was present to present this proposal. S.R.A.B. # 99-17: Chicaao and Main L.C.C.. 905 Chico o Ave. Mr. Bill Smith presented his proposal for two temporary real estate signs for the proposed construction. J. Weiss asked what the schedule for this project is, particularly the ground breaking. Mr. Smith replied that he thought possibly as early as the end of February Chairman Larson suggested that the Board review the issue of items of information. The main focus of the sign is the rendering, with the phone number and address information, which is already down to the basics J Weiss stated that he thought this appropriate. A discussion then took place regarding the length of time that the signage would be up, and when it mould need to be moved to accommodate the construction. C. Smith added that sidewalk protection would raved to be provided once the building superstructure began to be erected. During the foundation construction. the only required site protection is a chain link fence. J. Weiss motions the approval of the slans as submitted for a time oerlod beainnina now through a 24 month period. Should a permit not be secured by the end of February 2000, the s€striae must be removed. L. Berkun seconds this motion, and It was passed 3-0. S.R.A.B. # 99-18: The Cos Buildina. 2500 Ridge Ave. Mr. Murray, representing the Cos Building, presented the proposal for a freestanding sign. The parking lot and driveways were reconfigured as a part of a PUD in 1997. As a part of the requirement, a landscaped berm was mandated. As a direct result, the building is not as visible Even if it were visible, the design of the building does not lend itself to any building signage Mr. Murray confirmed for Mr. Gordon McGee, a npgttor that was present that the signage would be non -illuminated. The Board questioned rf Mr. McGee knew it the neighbors had any problems with the proposal Mr McGee responded that he did not wish to represent the neighbors M. Larson motions the approval of the scan. J. Weiss seconded this motion, and it was passed 3-0. S.R.A.B. # 99-19: Kaehler Luaaaae, 1724 Sherman Ave. Mr. Kaehler presented the proposed signage. He explained that in reviewing this proposal with a representative of the City, they were told that the sign would be allowed within the Code. and proceeded to have their sign company develop drawings for the sign. When they submitted it for the actual permit, itwas Sign Review and Appeals Board Meeting Minutes —December 9, 1999 Page 3 of 3 denied This cost them 3-4 weeks of wasted time. The advantage of this proposal, stated Mr. Kaehler, is that their logo will be displayed. If they would be required to stay within the band of the existing building projection, as Starbucks has done, this would rtot be possible C Smith gave some history on the Starbucks sign stating that the City allowed the sign as a'wall sign' as long as it did not project above the top of the canopy. C. Smith continued by noting that the existing architecture makes the application of the Ordinance particularly difficult J. Weiss said that although he can empathize, he could not support any signage that projected above the Iline of the existing projection. He continued that there is already a large marketing advantage inherent in beiry located out that far. Chairman Larson questioned if the sign could be rearranged such that 'Kaehler Travelworks' could be horizontal. although using the same typeface and color? Mr. Kaehler responded that Mis would not give them the recognition that they are looking for, that they have registered as a trademark. Chairman Larson commented that this is a horrible looking canopy to begin with, and squeezing a sign on might not be the right thing to do. J. Weiss responded that he is not inclined to support any motion that would vary from the type of sign that Starbucks has. Some discussion ensued involving different color combinations and graphic representations. Mr. Kaehler stated that anything other than their registered trademark puts them at a disadvantage. L. Berkun commented that she could appreciate how important it is for a retailer to have a definitive idenbrt Chairman Larson stated that it is unfair to penalize them, as there are many signs on this elevation already J Weiss responded that he thinks that the sign format could in fact vary from the print format, and that he strongly feels that the sign should not project from the top of the existing building projection. L. Berkun motions to aparove the or000sal as submitted. Chairman Larson seconds and the motion is not approved by a 2-1 vote. ADJOURNMENT Hearing no other business. Chairman Larson motioned adjournment at 8: 50 p.m. NEXT MEETING The next meeting of the S.R.AB. is for Thursday, January 13, 2000. Carolyn Smith, Istant Director Community Development - Building Division cc: J. Wolmski K. Mims